"Unless you are living on mung beans and water and running five miles a day, forgive me if I take your imprecations with a pinch of menthol-flavoured tobacco. Oh - I can’t - that’s been banned too."
I think many of us know this is not about helping the NHS. The question is, what is it about? Wielding more control? Closing down pubs? Avoiding lawsuits? What exactly is the underlying aim?
To be continued no doubt.
I hope that whatever Rayner may (or may not) have been ploughing into at her recent rave has all been appropriately cost offset.
Thanks Julie! I absolutely support sincere efforts to help folks improve their health. But that's not what this is. I get weary of it.
I did see that Ang Rayner had been to a rave. Is that like when Glenda Jackson was a Lab MP and went to Spain to chat to British holidaymakers in 1997 I wonder? Whatever, I'm sure she knows what she's doing!
You definitely sound a bit persecuted, I'm sorry! Do you know Garrison Keillor's essay about the last smokers in America...very funny. I have to say I don't smoke but grew up hating my mother's habit, so I'm no fan. But for many years I was on NHS Boards listening to public health experts explain why we had to ban tobacco to save lives, and always remember the person who asked 'so what do you want these people to die of instead?'...
Ha! Love that last bit Sarah! Thankfully we've come a long way in reducing the number of smokers and I'm all for that. I think cigarette smoking would have naturally dwindled away given the soaring cost of it, but vaping has given it a whole new lease of life. There is always money to be made from addiction, even by the government. I don't know the Garrison Keillor essay but it sounds like something I ought to read!
I no longer smoke but it seems to me a dangerous and perfidious development of state control to prevent people from smoking outdoors on private property or public spaces. The act of smoking is not, as yet, illegal and it strikes me that the government has no business interfering with a perfectly innocuous, personal, legal pastime. It should also be noted that although not limited to a specific demographic, smoking is most popular with those on lower incomes: A fine legacy for a Labour government!
You make an excellent point. Smoking cigarettes is an extremely expensive activity for what it is, but still cheaper than many other activities which are out of reach for many people. You hardly ever hear this point made because the political classes are so out of touch with those who struggle every day to survive.
Jules! I wasn't aware of the potential outdoor smoking ban in the UK and your take seems spot on to me. I love this post because I LOVED smoking. And if my father hadn't died of esophageal cancer at 68 after a lifetime of smoking, I probably would've never quit. In fact, when I walk by someone smoking a cigarette, I will slow down and bask in the second-hand smoke. I have a lot of ex-smoker friends who hate the smell, but I love it. It takes me right back to my youth. Honestly, I think cell phones are way more toxic than cigarettes. At least smoking was a social way to pass the time and one that encouraged connection. I made many friends and/or found an easy way to talk to an attractive person by asking for a light or to bum a smoke, whereas cell phone cut us off from others and scramble our brains. If I was waiting on a friend, a cigarette was a great way to the pass time and not feel alone.
Oh I'm so sorry about your dad, Hilary, but thanks for your wise take on this. I don't imagine that anyone who smokes thinks it's good for them but as you say, it used to be very ingrained in the culture. During the last century governments were happy for the population to get on with it even though they knew quite early on that it was harmful. It's only when they think it's costing them money as opposed to making them money that they take action. You are the only person, other than myself, that I have heard saying that they enjoy a waft of cigarette smoke in the street! 😆Me too! I haven't smoked a cigarette for a couple of years now so I get a vicarious thrill out of it. Thanks so much for your take on this H, I do appreciate it. The way smokers are spoken about in this country it's nice not to feel like a pariah! 😄💛
PS - I'm with you on cell phones. That's an addiction if ever there was one.
Excellent article Jules. Articulate and succinctly points out the flaws and contradictions with this. When I first read about these proposed changes, I was completely flummoxed too 🙄. For whose benefit? Like other readers have quoted, absolutely nothing to do with improving people's health or saving the NHS. I fail to see what underlying aim / benefits will be ? Absolutely ridiculous 🙄. Mr Starmer hardly gotten his feet under the table, and comes up with this nonsense!
Thanks Angie! Yes it's just bullying people and victimising one group because it's an easy target. It's been lovely to see even non-smokers being kind enough to speak out. I'm all for public health messaging but once people have the facts I feel strongly that they must be left to choose, ensuring that they don't harm others. This could be applied to any number of personal choices we make every day, not just smoking. Thanks for reading, and let's hope the PM doesn't carry on in this authoritarian manner or goodness knows what restrictions we'll be living under by the time he's done!
Perfect summation Juies. Indeed, people have the facts and it's THEIR right to choose. I'm a non-smoker, and I'm so irritated by this. Let's see what's next from our PM 😳
Excellent piece 👏 Exactly right, this is NOTHING to do with health or saving the NHS (peace be upon her, amen) money.....it's about Stalin, sorry, sorry, Starmer, wielding his big stick over the plebs. He's got small man syndrome plus, I think he knows the jig is up and he's not going to be around for long.....fingers crossed!
Ohhhh you're feisty today. Yeah, honestly, most hospital visits are probably avoidable. This is life. Some people smoke. When I was working for the man, I enjoyed many a fag too. It was the only way I got out of the office all day. I remember the Friends episode where Rachel started smoking because that's where the cool decision makers were hanging out. Shit gets sorted over a ciggie. That said, Jules, I've been off them for more than 10 years and I'm happy about it. Vapes have been banned in Australia. Still plenty of vaping going on but I don't leave the house much, lol.
Crikey! Vapes banned? Just goes to show, no one knows how best to solve this.
First of all, gold medal for giving up 💫
I smoked menthol fags until they banned them. I tried shoving peppermint tea bags or mint leaves in packs of ordinary cigs to try and make them minty. Didn't work. I didn't want to vape because I didn't smoke much and I didn't want to increase my dependency on nicotine, but the price of a packet just got astronomical so I caved in. Now I can at least have the occasional menthol vape.
Really, it's the hypocrisy I wanted to highlight. The government could ban smoking, but they don't want to lose the revenue from tobacco duty. Then they tell people they don't deserve treatment if they get ill. Everyone deserves treatment if they get ill, surely.
Totally agree. They want the money! One of the funniest covid laws passed in Victoria was you had to wear a mask outdoors unless you were eating or smoking. Talk about hypocrisy.
Oh COVID rules were a total shambles here too. The messaging was all over the place. Totally unprepared for something they knew was likely to happen. I think I heard that the new government is trying to recover all the money the last lot wasted on defective PPE, and PPE that never materialised. Maybe that's the black hole the tobacco duty ended up in!
Your critique of the smoking ban is both sharp and thought-provoking. I appreciate how you dissect the government's policies, exposing the contradictions and questioning the sincerity behind their actions. PS. I have the same bear as in your profile image :)
I no longer smoke but it seems to me a dangerous and perfidious development of state control to prevent people from smoking outdoors on private property or public spaces. The act of smoking is not, as yet, illegal and it strikes me that the government has no business interfering with a perfectly innocuous, personal, legal pastime. It should also be noted that although not limited to a specific demographic, smoking is most popular with those on lower incomes: A fine legacy for a Labour government!
I no longer smoke but it seems to me a dangerous and perfidious development of state control to prevent people from smoking outdoors on private property or public spaces. The act of smoking is not, as yet, illegal and it strikes me that the government has no business interfering with a perfectly innocuous, personal, legal pastime. It should also be noted that although not limited to a specific demographic, smoking is most popular with those on lower incomes: A fine legacy for a Labour government!
Enjoyed this.
"Unless you are living on mung beans and water and running five miles a day, forgive me if I take your imprecations with a pinch of menthol-flavoured tobacco. Oh - I can’t - that’s been banned too."
Hahaha. Yes!
😁
Great piece Julia. So many good points made.
I think many of us know this is not about helping the NHS. The question is, what is it about? Wielding more control? Closing down pubs? Avoiding lawsuits? What exactly is the underlying aim?
To be continued no doubt.
I hope that whatever Rayner may (or may not) have been ploughing into at her recent rave has all been appropriately cost offset.
Thanks Julie! I absolutely support sincere efforts to help folks improve their health. But that's not what this is. I get weary of it.
I did see that Ang Rayner had been to a rave. Is that like when Glenda Jackson was a Lab MP and went to Spain to chat to British holidaymakers in 1997 I wonder? Whatever, I'm sure she knows what she's doing!
Thanks for reading!
You definitely sound a bit persecuted, I'm sorry! Do you know Garrison Keillor's essay about the last smokers in America...very funny. I have to say I don't smoke but grew up hating my mother's habit, so I'm no fan. But for many years I was on NHS Boards listening to public health experts explain why we had to ban tobacco to save lives, and always remember the person who asked 'so what do you want these people to die of instead?'...
Ha! Love that last bit Sarah! Thankfully we've come a long way in reducing the number of smokers and I'm all for that. I think cigarette smoking would have naturally dwindled away given the soaring cost of it, but vaping has given it a whole new lease of life. There is always money to be made from addiction, even by the government. I don't know the Garrison Keillor essay but it sounds like something I ought to read!
I no longer smoke but it seems to me a dangerous and perfidious development of state control to prevent people from smoking outdoors on private property or public spaces. The act of smoking is not, as yet, illegal and it strikes me that the government has no business interfering with a perfectly innocuous, personal, legal pastime. It should also be noted that although not limited to a specific demographic, smoking is most popular with those on lower incomes: A fine legacy for a Labour government!
You make an excellent point. Smoking cigarettes is an extremely expensive activity for what it is, but still cheaper than many other activities which are out of reach for many people. You hardly ever hear this point made because the political classes are so out of touch with those who struggle every day to survive.
Jules! I wasn't aware of the potential outdoor smoking ban in the UK and your take seems spot on to me. I love this post because I LOVED smoking. And if my father hadn't died of esophageal cancer at 68 after a lifetime of smoking, I probably would've never quit. In fact, when I walk by someone smoking a cigarette, I will slow down and bask in the second-hand smoke. I have a lot of ex-smoker friends who hate the smell, but I love it. It takes me right back to my youth. Honestly, I think cell phones are way more toxic than cigarettes. At least smoking was a social way to pass the time and one that encouraged connection. I made many friends and/or found an easy way to talk to an attractive person by asking for a light or to bum a smoke, whereas cell phone cut us off from others and scramble our brains. If I was waiting on a friend, a cigarette was a great way to the pass time and not feel alone.
Oh I'm so sorry about your dad, Hilary, but thanks for your wise take on this. I don't imagine that anyone who smokes thinks it's good for them but as you say, it used to be very ingrained in the culture. During the last century governments were happy for the population to get on with it even though they knew quite early on that it was harmful. It's only when they think it's costing them money as opposed to making them money that they take action. You are the only person, other than myself, that I have heard saying that they enjoy a waft of cigarette smoke in the street! 😆Me too! I haven't smoked a cigarette for a couple of years now so I get a vicarious thrill out of it. Thanks so much for your take on this H, I do appreciate it. The way smokers are spoken about in this country it's nice not to feel like a pariah! 😄💛
PS - I'm with you on cell phones. That's an addiction if ever there was one.
Excellent article Jules. Articulate and succinctly points out the flaws and contradictions with this. When I first read about these proposed changes, I was completely flummoxed too 🙄. For whose benefit? Like other readers have quoted, absolutely nothing to do with improving people's health or saving the NHS. I fail to see what underlying aim / benefits will be ? Absolutely ridiculous 🙄. Mr Starmer hardly gotten his feet under the table, and comes up with this nonsense!
Thanks Angie! Yes it's just bullying people and victimising one group because it's an easy target. It's been lovely to see even non-smokers being kind enough to speak out. I'm all for public health messaging but once people have the facts I feel strongly that they must be left to choose, ensuring that they don't harm others. This could be applied to any number of personal choices we make every day, not just smoking. Thanks for reading, and let's hope the PM doesn't carry on in this authoritarian manner or goodness knows what restrictions we'll be living under by the time he's done!
Perfect summation Juies. Indeed, people have the facts and it's THEIR right to choose. I'm a non-smoker, and I'm so irritated by this. Let's see what's next from our PM 😳
It was nice to see the public acknowledgment that you’re not a dreary, nosey, officious little prig.
I thought so 😊
Excellent piece 👏 Exactly right, this is NOTHING to do with health or saving the NHS (peace be upon her, amen) money.....it's about Stalin, sorry, sorry, Starmer, wielding his big stick over the plebs. He's got small man syndrome plus, I think he knows the jig is up and he's not going to be around for long.....fingers crossed!
Thanks very much Toffeepud! Great handle, by the way!
Heaven knows what's coming next. These politicians make me scratch my head, they really do.
Thanks for reading 😊
You're welcome 😊
Ohhhh you're feisty today. Yeah, honestly, most hospital visits are probably avoidable. This is life. Some people smoke. When I was working for the man, I enjoyed many a fag too. It was the only way I got out of the office all day. I remember the Friends episode where Rachel started smoking because that's where the cool decision makers were hanging out. Shit gets sorted over a ciggie. That said, Jules, I've been off them for more than 10 years and I'm happy about it. Vapes have been banned in Australia. Still plenty of vaping going on but I don't leave the house much, lol.
Crikey! Vapes banned? Just goes to show, no one knows how best to solve this.
First of all, gold medal for giving up 💫
I smoked menthol fags until they banned them. I tried shoving peppermint tea bags or mint leaves in packs of ordinary cigs to try and make them minty. Didn't work. I didn't want to vape because I didn't smoke much and I didn't want to increase my dependency on nicotine, but the price of a packet just got astronomical so I caved in. Now I can at least have the occasional menthol vape.
Really, it's the hypocrisy I wanted to highlight. The government could ban smoking, but they don't want to lose the revenue from tobacco duty. Then they tell people they don't deserve treatment if they get ill. Everyone deserves treatment if they get ill, surely.
Thanks for the read and the restack 😊
Totally agree. They want the money! One of the funniest covid laws passed in Victoria was you had to wear a mask outdoors unless you were eating or smoking. Talk about hypocrisy.
Oh COVID rules were a total shambles here too. The messaging was all over the place. Totally unprepared for something they knew was likely to happen. I think I heard that the new government is trying to recover all the money the last lot wasted on defective PPE, and PPE that never materialised. Maybe that's the black hole the tobacco duty ended up in!
I started smoking at age 12 and it was the hardest thing I've ever had to quit. And I'm so thankful that I no longer smoke.
There's nothing quite like the feeling you describe, and that's what I think was hardest to quit.
Thanks for posting.
Well done Diana. I am in awe of people who just quit, particularly heavy smokers.
Thanks for reading 😊
Your critique of the smoking ban is both sharp and thought-provoking. I appreciate how you dissect the government's policies, exposing the contradictions and questioning the sincerity behind their actions. PS. I have the same bear as in your profile image :)
Thanks so much, Jon.
Oh my goodness! Winston has a doppelgänger! 😆
Indeed. I’ve had him since I was a baby :)
https://www.garrisonkeillor.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/05/9780140131567_WeAreStillMarried_End-of-Trail.pdf
GK has to be a smoker! 🤣Thanks!
I no longer smoke but it seems to me a dangerous and perfidious development of state control to prevent people from smoking outdoors on private property or public spaces. The act of smoking is not, as yet, illegal and it strikes me that the government has no business interfering with a perfectly innocuous, personal, legal pastime. It should also be noted that although not limited to a specific demographic, smoking is most popular with those on lower incomes: A fine legacy for a Labour government!
I no longer smoke but it seems to me a dangerous and perfidious development of state control to prevent people from smoking outdoors on private property or public spaces. The act of smoking is not, as yet, illegal and it strikes me that the government has no business interfering with a perfectly innocuous, personal, legal pastime. It should also be noted that although not limited to a specific demographic, smoking is most popular with those on lower incomes: A fine legacy for a Labour government!